This is the transcript of Restitutio episode 559: Youth Ministry Matters with Joshua Michael Smith This transcript was auto-generated and only approximates the contents of this episode. 00:08 Sean Finnegan Hey there, I'm Sean Finnegan. And you are listening to Restitutio podcast that seeks to recover authentic Christianity and live it out today. 00:24 Sean Finnegan Last week, Joshua Michael Smith began sharing his testimony from childhood to his. 00:29 Sean Finnegan College years, when he changed his mind about Jesus's identity in Part 2. Today he talks about Cage stage Unitarianism, where one seeks to confront everyone about this important truth, regardless of their interest or antagonism. Smith shares how he matured while continuing to work within Assemblies of God and Baptist churches in Tennessee. 00:51 Sean Finnegan Then we broached the topic of youth ministry. Smith explains why it's so important and what he hopes to accomplish as the new Youth Ministry coordinator at living. 01:01 Sean Finnegan Hope here now is Episode 559 youth ministry matters with Joshua Michael Smith. 01:15 Sean Finnegan So you were working through this, took you a couple of weeks talking to this theology and talking to the security guard, and then presumably also praying, reading, figuring stuff out. What was next for you? 01:27 Sean Finnegan Were you? Was it just like simply like a a switch? 01:29 Joshua Smith That flipped well at first. The biggest switch, and it really was a switch, my friend. 01:36 Joshua Smith Was walking in front of me and I was reading the Scripture and I had just tried to talk to him and another friend about my belief like, hey, what do you think about this? And they thought I was crazy anyways. And so I was reading the Scriptures and I got to this one verse in John where it says, who is he that overcomes but he that believes that Jesus is the son of God. 01:55 Joshua Smith And I actually scared my friend in front of me cause I went. I breathed in and I just had this aha moment that the designation of Christ and the New Testament is son of God. 02:06 Joshua Smith God and in my case I had been told God the son. 02:08 Joshua Smith And all. 02:09 Joshua Smith These other things and God, man. But son of God, what marks a Christian, as you say, he's the Christ. He's the son of God. But I had that moment. I really didn't know. 02:09 Sean Finnegan And God man. 02:19 Joshua Smith What I was because I had been told my entire life that if you don't believe in the deity of Christ and the. 02:25 Joshua Smith Strictest sense that. 02:27 Joshua Smith You're an adult or you are wrong in your. Whatever I I had all these ideas, but I was like, I see it so clearly I didn't have everything figured out, but just like a lot of the basic things like this is. 02:38 Joshua Smith Not. 02:38 Joshua Smith Making sense to me, I was like, am I a Jehovah's Witness? Am I? I mean, really. And I didn't really know anything about him. I used to talk. I I actually remember having a conversation. Dunkin' Donuts. 02:48 Joshua Smith With a Jehovah's Witness about the Trinity and trying to prove the. 02:51 Joshua Smith To him, I didn't know what I was. I was like, am I Mormon, you know, or whatever. But very quickly, I went. OK, well, I do not believe anything that goes against from the scripture because my whole goal was Sola scripture, that that was my goal. OK. And so I wanted to stay in the scripture. I just started doing some research and. 03:11 Joshua Smith I found Anthony Buzzard. 03:13 Sean Finnegan Now, how did you come across him? 03:15 Joshua Smith My friend that got me just asking questions about the Trinity, not even about the deity of Jesus. Really. It was more about the Trinity. You got me thinking about that and then I kind of. 03:23 Joshua Smith Went down all. 03:23 Joshua Smith These other rabbit holes, he was on a web, Facebook or something. I've watched a few videos of him talking and I was like, OK, this guy's actually I'm kind of this. I'm seeing this and he's kind of saying some of the things that I'm seeing. 03:36 Joshua Smith So then I got his number. I called him, talked to. 03:38 Joshua Smith Him. 03:39 Sean Finnegan I'm talking about Anthony Buzzin, OK? 03:40 Joshua Smith Anthony Buzzard and and then me and my buddy drove all the way down to Atlanta Bible College and stayed with Anthony Buzzard and his wife for. 03:48 Joshua Smith The weekend asked him tons of questions and Anthony, if anybody knows he will. He has a lot of things to say on everything. It's great. I mean, I just talked to him the whole weekend and it was great and I even some of the people at the last camp, we just got back from going to. I know them from 12 years ago because they were at the college. They were starting when I went there to visit. I also had dreads at the time. 04:08 Joshua Smith Which is even funnier. That led me to Dan Gill. Dan Gill actually came down and picked me up because they live up in Nashville. So it's about a 2 1/2 hour drive, 3 hour drive. And I talked about the Bible all weekend. His wife cooked for me and that was amazing. All these questions, all these things I had. 04:27 Joshua Smith And then I believe it was Anthony that put me in contact with you, right? And you guys were doing the revive for the first time and I just happened, I mean, I was a broke college student at the time and I just happened to have like 300 and something dollars in airfare credit because I had, you know, switched flights. And they gave me money. And you're like, hey, come up here and. 04:47 Joshua Smith Was like. Sure. He's like, yeah, if you get a plane ticket, you know, I I think you guys even took care of stuff for me that weekend. And I came up there and. 04:54 Joshua Smith And then met you and met everybody and nobody was married with kids yet. I mean, you had a couple of kids, but everybody else wasn't. I mean, it was the very beginning. Yeah. And then just over time, I just kept. I went back to revive consistently. 05:07 Sean Finnegan Yeah, you've been to family camp a couple of times since then. 05:09 Joshua Smith Yeah, family camp. I took my mom to my sister. 05:13 Sean Finnegan You've been living in Chattanooga. 05:15 Sean Finnegan Which which is where you. 05:16 Joshua Smith Just. Yeah, that's where I went to school. 05:16 Sean Finnegan Cool is that. 05:17 Sean Finnegan Right. 05:18 Sean Finnegan And you continue living down there for the last 10 years, but it's not like you've been doing nothing. I mean you. 05:23 Sean Finnegan Been active in so many different churches in so many different youth ministries and events. Maybe you could talk about that a little bit and your experience as a Biblical Unitarian working in these different kinds of situations with evangelical Christians. 05:38 Joshua Smith So the first instance I had where I I was doing ministry with a group of people that had a different view. 05:46 Joshua Smith On. 05:46 Joshua Smith God was when I went back to the where life they had a camp. 05:51 Joshua Smith And I went back as a. 05:52 Joshua Smith Leader. 05:53 Joshua Smith OK. And so I was like basically I had four or five other groups of people under me that we did like the lawn and whatever. And I just had to like nothing crazy. But I just had to help the leaders of those people make sure things were going well, deal with issues. If you have a bunch of teenagers that are working, you know, you have all. 06:11 Joshua Smith Kinds of problems. 06:11 Sean Finnegan You're going to have issues, yeah. 06:12 Joshua Smith And they they specifically hired me to do that because I've not always been the most organized person, but I'm very people oriented. Organizational people are great. I need them. My wife is like that. But sometimes we can get very busy and we can miss people. And so I just say that to say that, you know, I was known as someone. 06:30 Joshua Smith Anyone who, if you needed prayer, you know, I was there. Whatever you needed. And so that's why they put me there. I found out later that actually one of the guys that was above me knew that I didn't believe what I had changed my mind, which I'm not really sure how he figured that out because I hadn't really been. 06:46 Joshua Smith Super public. Maybe it's how. 06:48 Joshua Smith Well, that maybe it's just there was one time. This was an interesting thing. Some people maybe relate, but we were talking and we were in a group of people and he said some Christians don't believe Jesus is God. 07:00 Joshua Smith He looked at me and I remember not. We had never talked about it. 07:04 Joshua Smith I was like. 07:05 Joshua Smith I wasn't scared to talk about it, but I was also like, OK, what? It had to be for me, looking back, you know, it had to be that whole summer I helped lead worship, I helped the youth band there. We had a a band for the youth. They had their own thing and then the actual camp had their own stuff. And anyways, I shared a lot of messages. 07:25 Joshua Smith And and I found it interesting. There's so many things in the Bible we can talk about and we can share the parables of Jesus. We can share a lot of scripture and it really isn't the main. 07:35 Joshua Smith For all intents and purposes, a lot of people read a passage about God and Jesus and assume they're separate. Assume Jesus is a human Lord, that God's put over. Like all these things come into play and I just found that if I if I shared the Scripture and I preach the scripture, that I would be able to give life to people. 07:54 Joshua Smith And in turn, people would would get closer to God. 07:57 Joshua Smith If I was a missionary or I was called to go to. 08:01 Joshua Smith Let's say an Islam a a country that Islam is involved in the politics right? And the way they rule. 08:08 Joshua Smith There's a lot of things you can do to create relationships with people. 08:12 Joshua Smith But you wouldn't do that by going in and saying all how you disagree with everybody, especially if you just go in charging with Mohammed is dead and you know this. He's not a real prophet. It just wouldn't be good. You wouldn't have a lot of influence with people. And so I really asked God to help me because I felt like I was supposed to be in Chattanooga for a time. 08:31 Joshua Smith And maybe that was he was setting things up. I met my wife later. I think I realized that part of my desire to actually share my beliefs sometimes we're we're more based upon my. Like, I like to debate. I like a good fight. And there's nothing wrong with that. I think. I think Paul probably was the same way, but I think there's a difference between. 08:53 Joshua Smith Following I want to do this and I want to talk about this versus God leading you in the spirit to do things at the beginning I felt so much pressure to have to tell everybody and convince everybody in a way that really wasn't helpful to me. And I think it created more anxiety than it did actual faith. 09:13 Sean Finnegan When you told people, did they? 09:14 Joshua Smith Kick you out. What happened is there was several churches I worked at. 09:18 Joshua Smith They were uh, zombies of God, and they're really big on the kenosis theory, so I could literally I talked all the time about being like Christ. He was in. They talk about him in relationship with God. It's really interesting. You've ever talked to some God, they're very they have a a very interesting culture of how they they view it, at least the ones that I was a part of. I remember one time we were at at the Bible study we did every other Thursday night. 09:39 Joshua Smith It started out as a young adults thing, but then it just tons of people. It's almost like a little church. 09:44 Joshua Smith Built up and I talked to the leader about it and and this other guy that was there, he had a different view. Not what I have necessarily, but he had some view with the father, son and spirit that was different than what he did. And we all talked about it and we all agreed that we were all Christians and brothers and that we just love each other and so. 10:04 Joshua Smith In that particular Bible study, the spirit of that group was to get people to see that they could live like Christ. And so we talked about that all the time in different ways. We talked a lot about getting rid of a lot of the entertainment in our life that steals from us. There's a lot of things that people need to hear. 10:21 Joshua Smith And we don't always have to disagree with people. And I think also in that season in my life, I was really learning a lot of things. I was learning, like for instance service, you know, Jesus was a servant 30 years before he ever did his actual ministry. You know, he was taking care of his mother. You know, he was working. He was going to synagogue. He was doing the things that he was called to do. 10:44 Joshua Smith And I think that's probably where he developed a lot. I know it is where he developed. I'm going to. 10:49 Joshua Smith Thank God, I was always, especially now a little bit more mature, a little older. My wife might disagree with the maturity part, but you know more mature than I was for sure. I love and Isaiah, where where it talks about he will not judge on what his I see, you know, or his ears here. And there's a time for things. And I I love truth. 11:05 Sean Finnegan That's a 11, yeah. 11:10 Joshua Smith And and I've never been able to, you know, truth is what it is, you know, truth doesn't change. 11:16 Joshua Smith I really had a desire to have the servant heart of Christ as opposed to just all the knowledge, and it's very easy and this is anybody, I mean people that get in apologetics. You could do it for the wrong reason. You could go out and try to disprove Islam strictly because you think it's stupid and you want to disprove people. I don't think you'll be that effective. 11:36 Joshua Smith You might win a debate. I don't see God looking down and being pleased with your life. 11:41 Joshua Smith There was one time. This is funny, yet so right before I left, one of the this one Assemblies of God Church. They had never made me sign anything and they wanted to sign something. They had this check box for stuff and they had two boxes. They had one. He's the son of God and the second One, Jesus is God now. 11:56 Joshua Smith It's funny. I actually believe Jesus is God, but in a a very different way, right? Because the in the Hebrew Bible, people are called God. But in that sentence, the way they structured it. So I just checked the son of God, I didn't check the. 12:08 Joshua Smith One and I was only there for another month and they never looked at it. So it was one of those things where I was like and they never done it before. And I I've noticed a lot of churches doing it more and it I don't understand that. And half the time people check things they don't even know cause that Jesus is God or Jesus, son of God. If those two things you could be a modelist and check that off. It's not even exact. 12:28 Sean Finnegan Yeah, right. 12:28 Joshua Smith To what the Orthodox position is. 12:31 Yeah. 12:31 Joshua Smith Getting married and having kids. I adopted my my wife's two kids and then we had our own. 12:38 Joshua Smith I really wanted to be in a community where those things were talked about very plainly. Yeah, for the year and a half or year that we were at a Baptist Church in Chattanooga. 12:49 Joshua Smith I taught my kids what I thought from Scripture, but they would go to Sunday school and get something else. But nine times out of 10, they never taught. They really didn't make a big deal about it. It doesn't come up as much as what people think. It's very rare. But when it would come up, you know, they talk about it. And my kids even, they just it never made sense to them because, you know, you're telling me to believe that Jesus is the same person that sent him. 13:10 Joshua Smith He's his own dad and I know that's not what they're saying, but that's how a child looks at it. 13:14 Sean Finnegan Right. That's how they. 13:15 Joshua Smith Hear it? But yeah, that was a, you know, I think a big moment, too was when Connor, my middle child, now is very inquisitive, especially at night time. He's very inquisitive. 13:24 Sean Finnegan When he should be going. 13:24 Sean Finnegan To bed starts asking all the questions. 13:25 Joshua Smith Yeah, but he that's just how he is. He just has all these things and he. But he was asking about Jesus. And I remember just being like, hey, well, who was he is his dad and he's like God. So Jesus is what? God's son. It's a really simple idea. 13:39 Joshua Smith But that also made me think that I I really would like to be more open about my faith and the things I think and the journey I went down because one I I do believe in respect and I and I do believe that, you know one thing it says in Jane, it says the wisdom that's from above 1 of it says it yields. 14:00 Joshua Smith And it's an interesting thing where. 14:03 Sean Finnegan The verse you're thinking of James 317, but the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield full of mercy and good fruits without a trace of partiality or hypocrisy. 14:16 Joshua Smith You know one thing my wife has really challenged me on is that if you know a lot of things in the scripture. 14:22 Joshua Smith But you don't have the fruit of the spirit. 14:25 Joshua Smith Consistently doesn't mean that you don't mess up, like if you don't have that, what's the point of having the truth? 14:31 Joshua Smith If you don't have those things and and I I look back at church history and I see fighting and I see so many things, I don't see the fruit of the spirit and this really challenged me. It just got me thinking because I always want to remember that while I I want to stand upon truth, I think it's very important. It doesn't mean that you're always on the attack. For instance, there's a lot of things I've learned like. 14:53 Joshua Smith Several pastors I know in Chattanooga and some other places, several of them, they know what I think some of them. 15:00 Joshua Smith Wondered what I thought. Maybe they just never wanted to ask me because they didn't want, you know, the full answer. I don't. I don't know. But I learned a lot from them and a lot of things I do now come from learning from a lot of people. And there is this sense of respect and honor that maybe it's it's not a very American thing because when when we kicked the British out basically, you know, so there is this sense. 15:21 Joshua Smith But there is this sense of like honoring. 15:23 Joshua Smith People and being able to yield not and and and that's one thing too yielding there I don't think means that I I say you're right, I don't have to get other people to think like me and to see everything that I see the early years of my Christianity and especially when I started to change my views on a lot of these things because there's other topics I changed too that emanated from that study. 15:44 Joshua Smith I felt such press. 15:46 Joshua Smith And it was just like, just huge pressure on my back. I don't think that that's a very healthy thing because I think it's very difficult to do anything because you're always, you're in a fight or flight kind of mindset, whereas in Jesus, I see when he starts doing ministry, he went to God. 16:06 Joshua Smith Consistently had a prayer life where he went to God. The most important thing to him was spending time with God, but then out of that he was able to do things. And he said some really tough thing. 16:15 Joshua Smith But you know, I don't think, he said the Pharisees, that they were what they were in a obviously we don't think this cause, you know, he lived a perfect life. But he didn't say that in A to point out the baddest of their character and and the wrongness it was from the spirit of God. One of my hopes is that it's not really hope. I think it's already happening that people will start to see. 16:35 Joshua Smith The legitimacy of the Unitarian movement that you know God is one and and his son is his son in a real, actual way. Mm-hmm. And I do think that is starting to happen because there are a lot of people. 16:49 Joshua Smith People who are doing real ministry and I think one thing that I'm feel God really pushing me to be more is that we always talk about the opposition or not always. But you know it we can't help it. You know, we're a small fish in a big pond but there's so many people that are hurting that don't even know that there is a God that loves them and send his son. 17:11 Joshua Smith If we spent more time and this is me, if Joshua spent more time finding people that are lost and broken and connecting them to God through Jesus Christ. 17:22 Joshua Smith Our movement would grow and we'd be bringing people that are in complete peril. It's not like they have one little thing that's that's wrong, that comes up from time to time. But you know and and that's kind of I think been a big goal in my heart. And then also, you know, asking myself like, OK, I believe this. 17:42 Joshua Smith Does this give me passion? Does this give me peace every day when things are difficult? Is this the bedrock of my faith? Matthew 1616? More so than my theological position. 17:54 Hmm. 17:54 Joshua Smith Is this making me into the man that I desire to be? Yeah. So I say all that 10 years and obviously I've, I believe all these things cause I'm here. I'm working with the church. I love it, you know. 18:04 Sean Finnegan Yeah. And you and you and you, had you had a lot of development during that time, a lot of 10 years and you learned a lot and you met this lady Brittany. I did. And you were at some kind of church. Was it a Baptist? 18:18 Joshua Smith Church, the Dean of men at Tennessee Temple before they they really shut down, but they another college kind of bought them out. 18:25 Joshua Smith They moved to Nashville and the Dean of men, and then his wife worked in the some kind of administrator position. 18:32 Joshua Smith I went up there and I had helped them lead worship on and off, and so I would go up there and and lead worship for them. 18:39 Joshua Smith So the the lady. She is a very blunt person. She was kind of like a A. 18:43 Joshua Smith Mom to me, she. 18:44 Sean Finnegan OK. 18:46 Joshua Smith She tells me, and I can say this, this is not I'm not, you know, maybe this some people might seem to just rash, but this is exactly what she said, she said. 18:53 Joshua Smith Hey, Josh, there's this great girl that started coming to our church. Her husband committed suicide. I think that she needs somebody who really loves Jesus. You should meet her. That's the exact what? Jesus and. 19:02 Sean Finnegan Sales pitch. 19:06 Joshua Smith And anyways, Long story short, you know it was great. I did connect with her and she honestly that has been probably one of the most life changing heart changing decisions and interactions in my entire life for her, the kids, everything it completely. 19:19 Sean Finnegan Yeah, development, yeah. 19:23 Joshua Smith Change me. 19:24 Sean Finnegan And so she had two kids, and you started dating her. And then two years ago, you got married. Yeah. And then a year ago, your son Andrew was born, not. 19:34 Joshua Smith A year ago 5. 19:35 Sean Finnegan Months five months ago. Yeah. Thank you. So within a year and a half, you went from a single guy in his 30s. 19:44 Sean Finnegan 2 married with three kids. 19:46 Joshua Smith Yeah, pretty much. I've always been a very that's a. 19:49 Sean Finnegan Fast. 19:49 Joshua Smith Track. I've always been a fast track person. I I think a lot of times. 19:51 Yeah. 19:54 Joshua Smith Now I'm not old, but I'm 34, so I'm just enough that you can start to think, oh, I could have done this. I should have done this. You know, that kind of stuff. I look back and I look at all the people and relationships and friendships that I've had and different ministries I've worked with and I realize. 20:07 Joshua Smith All of that prepared me for exactly where I am right now, and sure, could I done certain things better? Maybe fix this a little sooner, you know, added this into my life. 20:18 Joshua Smith But I see God working and I think the worst thing you can do is look back and to think. Well, I didn't do that because you can't change the past and God wants to give us a future, yeah. 20:29 Sean Finnegan And so you now you have just moved up here to New York to be part of living. Hope you're on staff here working with youth ministry. The question I would ask is. 20:40 Sean Finnegan This. 20:41 Sean Finnegan Why do you believe in youth ministry? Why is that something that is important to you? Because it seems like even way back you were involved in youth ministry all throughout and now you're doing it professionally. So what is it about youth ministry? You think that's so? 20:56 Joshua Smith Important. Well, it is interesting that I don't know where this came from because I went. 21:02 Joshua Smith From, you know, in high school, typical smoking pot drinking, that kind of group to four months later, teaching Sunday school like, but not just like, you know, actually being involved and doing stuff with the kids and being actively involved in church. 21:16 Joshua Smith When I was 18, I lost all my friends. That's something that just happens. I lost basically everybody they they thought I was judging them. You know, I really wasn't. And. But anyways, when I asked. Hey, where's the place that needs help, you know, or what can I do? And they're like, somehow I'd heard about the 5th grade boys and how crazy they were. And and our church at the time was the 5th grade boys. 21:23 Sean Finnegan That can relate. 21:36 Joshua Smith And like, Oh yeah, they're just terrible. And, you know, they said all this stuff. And I was like, ohh, I'll, I'll take it. I'll do it. So I did it and. 21:43 Joshua Smith And I I remember using movies and, you know, spending a lot of time for a 20 minute, you know, 1520 minute thing where you're trying to get them to listen to you. And it was huge because I realized, number one, I could keep their attention. And it was really weird, too, seeing now a lot of them, I end up going before they went into high school and stuff. So I didn't have a long term relationship with them. 22:04 Joshua Smith But I saw them later on older and it just kind of just clicked in me like. 22:08 Joshua Smith Man, the things you do with young people have big implications and I do not think I don't believe in. 22:16 Joshua Smith Everything has to be hip and you have to be, but you do have to be relatable to the culture. Why I say that is I think a lot of people leave the Church and Baptists are really good for numbers. They have a lot of churches and we we might disagree with them on several points, but at the end of the day they do a lot of evangelism. They haven't a growth mindset and they're really big on numbers. They know how many people leave the church. 22:38 Joshua Smith And a lot of people go off to college and they don't come back to church. It's just it's just a fact and it's actually cross denominations. It's just they've done a lot of research on the number. 22:47 Joshua Smith Why is that? It's not that they don't have fun, because there's definitely youth groups that have fun, but sometimes it's not. You can have a boring youth. 22:53 Joshua Smith Program that's not good. 22:55 Joshua Smith But there's this place where interacting with them in their culture. I think a lot of it starts with, you know, why are you doing youth ministry? Why is it important? Well, it's only the next generation. It's like and again, it is hard. It is frustrating when you pour your heart into people and they make terrible decisions. 23:16 Joshua Smith And I had somebody tell me this in Bible college. I can be kind of a I won't say the word, but the smart. But you know what I mean. 23:23 Joshua Smith I won't say. 23:24 Joshua Smith On the podcast, Alec and I didn't get it. This girl at Word of life, some of the kids under me and she said you have the gift of mercy. Like, OK, well. And I was. Joe was like, doesn't everybody have it? 23:24 Sean Finnegan So smart. 23:34 Joshua Smith We're Christians, right? We on mercy. 23:36 Joshua Smith But I thought about it and I don't know if that's something only some people have, because obviously we're all supposed to give mercy. But I've always been forgiven of so much. I've had so many things in my life that I've been forgiven, that I tend to give out for mercy really easy. 23:50 Joshua Smith A lot of times with youth ministry, what's so hard is that you have to deal with you. Pour your heart into people's kids and it happens the same thing with adults. But I think with kids, maybe because they're just tougher because they're, they're going through all these things, their their bodies are changing, they're going through all this stuff. You pour your heart into them. 24:11 Joshua Smith And then. 24:12 Joshua Smith They make a bad decision and it just really hurts you and you feel like they're your own kids. And if you've ever done ministry youth with anybody, mentorship, if you're doing it right, that's how it feels. People just don't like it. You know, people have sometimes people have kids that don't go on to be Christians, and they assume that, well, I I suck at this. 24:32 Joshua Smith I obviously you know or maybe they're not, you know, to the level that they are and like their maturity, people have all these reasons that keep them from being a mentor, reaching out to kids and. 24:44 Joshua Smith Churches. I think it's interesting too, because the kids, it's sometimes hard to see their value because they're not. And again, it's not about money, but they don't bring any monetary value. They actually take money. They take a lot of investment, and sometimes it feels like very little return. It's not, but it. That's how it feels. And now being a parent, I understand that in a real way. 25:04 Joshua Smith But if we don't focus on the youth like the world is going after them, the world. 25:10 Joshua Smith World. 25:11 Joshua Smith The devil wants he wants to get them young. He wants to mess them up. He wants to mess them up sexually. He wants to mess them up in their mind. He wants to get them confused as to, you know, the scriptures. And you know, he wants to get. He wants to get all these different ideas in their mind before they ever so they don't never have a chance. 25:31 Joshua Smith There's a lot of battle. There's a lot of battle because because it is to some degree, the first one who gets there. Kinda like there. There are kids that get into the world and they get really into it and without God bringing them out, you know, it's hard. But there's also a lot of kids that haven't made-up their mind yet. 25:33 Sean Finnegan Spiritual warfare. 25:49 Joshua Smith As a parent, this is really tempting. 25:52 Joshua Smith Well, they're around people. They're hearing the word of God. They'll figure it out. I think that's what we think. And can I tell you that? 25:59 Joshua Smith Is not. 26:01 Joshua Smith Right, right. Not. No. They'll actually not figure. Yes. And discipleship being very intentional about the questions you ask, there's a way to talk to kids about sexual purity and about tough subjects and the culture without putting a lot of guilt and shame. 26:19 Joshua Smith It's hard. I mean, I think the reason why people don't do it is it's hard. And then if you work in an area and this is, you know, we're kind of in Chattanooga, there's a lot of gangs we actually had. I knew him a little bit, but a 17 year old that we're pretty sure he went to go get drugs. And it was a fake like it was a fake drug deal. 26:38 Joshua Smith And he was shot. You know, they shot his car like 50 times. 26:41 Wow. 26:42 Joshua Smith You know, I think about this too, because. 26:44 Joshua Smith You know, one of my friends, he, he put, he knew that kid when he was 5. 26:49 Joshua Smith And. 26:50 Joshua Smith It's tough. 26:52 Joshua Smith But there's other kids that did come out, you know. And so I think about, you know, why? Why should we invest our time? Why should we use resources? Why should we go through the? The trouble is because of that, there's kids that that don't have good parents that don't have or if they do have good parents, they need other people, they need the church to step in. 27:13 Joshua Smith And there's there's just a balance of like on one hand, telling the truth, but also loving them and having mercy for them. Because I think about me, the people that made a huge difference in my life were those men and women that would tell me the truth. But I also I felt like they really wanted. 27:28 Joshua Smith To. 27:28 Joshua Smith Help me. I'm reading the book right now, actually one that. 27:28 Yeah. 27:31 Joshua Smith You got me the first thing he says. You have to have is is a great youth leader and that's anybody that's that's not a position that's you know, anybody who's going to work with youth. 27:40 Joshua Smith You have to have a rich relationship with God. 27:43 Joshua Smith Because then you actually live that out right when you have things happen in your life, you go to prayer. When you pray, you don't use just fancy words. You don't just say what what other people you you pray from your heart and they they start to see that. I think another thing a lot of times it's hard to work with kids because they see right through you. So if you're bsing. 28:03 Joshua Smith And you're not real. 28:05 Joshua Smith They will call you out and it's tough if anybody ever has, you know, if you have a strong little child. I have one. Sometimes he's right. I have to admit sometimes he is dead. Right. And that's hard. Yeah. But it also makes you better because the goal I think of working with youth is to truly desire for them to be better off, not in your own idea like. 28:26 Joshua Smith But really, to be have a rich relationship with God, have a great marriage and family, if that's what they choose, feel good about their life and the ministry that God's given to them and be full of peace and life. 28:38 Joshua Smith And if that's really what you want. 28:40 Joshua Smith You can get through those tough things, yeah. 28:43 Sean Finnegan So you're saying it's worth it? 28:45 Joshua Smith Oh, it's 100% worth it. And then one day they're older and you see them and they're married and or they're going to a new job or new thing and they're still. I've met people like that, people that I I influenced years ago. It changes you. You see people. 28:46 Sean Finnegan It's it's worth it, but you. 29:01 Joshua Smith And you see that little bit that you had in their life, which is true of adults. It's true of anybody. It's just with young people. You have so much hope for them because they're just a blank slate. And maybe that's what makes it hurt more, I don't know, cause adults can hurt us too. We can see. 29:13 Joshua Smith People and they go. 29:13 Ohh yeah. 29:14 Sean Finnegan Back, you know, ministry is not for the faint of heart. It can be very difficult, but it is worth it. 29:21 Sean Finnegan Because you're doing the will of God, you're you're working with people, and you do have wins and you have losses. 29:29 Sean Finnegan Just like probably any other field in life, but it's more painful because you're dealing with people and not sales or services. You know what I mean? But that's par for the course when you're talking. I was thinking of a sailing metaphor, which you have to forgive me because not everyone is going to relate to this, but. 29:37 Joshua Smith Yeah. 29:47 Sean Finnegan In sailing. 29:50 Sean Finnegan The wind is blowing. 29:53 Sean Finnegan A certain direction. 29:55 Sean Finnegan And let's say the wind is blowing against you. The wind is blowing down from the north, and let's say you want to go north. 30:04 Sean Finnegan If you do nothing with your boat, you're just going to get blown towards the South. 30:09 Sean Finnegan That's and that's like the kid that is going through the motions of this world. They're just getting blown South. 30:18 Sean Finnegan And you know, with the ministry and with Christian community or godly parents or youth ministry all working together, what we're doing is we're turning that boat into. 30:28 Sean Finnegan The wind. And here's the crazy thing is that you can sail not directly at the wind, but just a little bit of an angle and. 30:35 Sean Finnegan That wind will actually. 30:36 Sean Finnegan Power you to go in the direction the opposite direction as as if you did nothing and you just went S, you could actually head not exactly N, But you know northeast and then you could turn go northwest. 30:49 Sean Finnegan My point is that wind will actually power you to move if you are able to take advantage of it, and so maybe I don't know if it's a very good analogy. But you know, the idea is that. 31:01 Sean Finnegan Yeah, we're in the same wind we're in. You know, there are these forces pushing us in a certain direction and we're having to, like, go in the difficult direction. And we're asking the kids to do the same. So I think it is incredibly valuable work. Before we we close up, is there anything else you'd like to mention? Just about yourself, your own journey or? 31:21 Sean Finnegan Your vision for youth ministry before we finish up. 31:24 Sean Finnegan Sure. 31:25 Joshua Smith Well, the one thing that that keeps people and one thing that I from doing working with youth more is they complicate it and they think that I need to have whatever they think having their stuff together looks like they need to have that. And I think all you need to have is faith and a relationship with God. I look at my whole life. 31:46 Joshua Smith And and why I want to work with youth and why I'm here. It's because I just realize that people, especially young people, because a lot of times they haven't figured out what they want, yet they haven't. 31:57 Joshua Smith Figured out their identity. 32:00 Joshua Smith I want to get as many as I can to have an idea. 32:03 Joshua Smith 3. 32:04 Joshua Smith And the Kingdom of God, God sending his Messiah giving us life. God being our father. You know, I didn't have a father. That was that part. He's not a big part of my life. I love him. But it's just he's not really there. But I have a heavenly Father that is there. That's that's invested in every part of my life and wants me to become the man that he's calling. 32:24 Joshua Smith To be and I think from the perspective of a man, every man wants that. And I do believe in mentorship. I do believe in men need other men, but the greatest thing that they need is to to be connected to their heavenly Father. That's hard. And that you have to maybe go through difficult situations, but it's a really easy thing. People are looking for hope they're looking for. 32:44 Joshua Smith Something. 32:46 Joshua Smith To get them through the tough things in their life, and sometimes it's just as simple as being there. Being willing, having an event at your house and people show up at some point like it's just one of those things to wear when you're available and you really love people. People see it, they see the genuineness of your love. I think that's what it's really. 33:04 Sean Finnegan About well, thanks for talking with me today. 33:07 Sean Finnegan Appreciate your time. 33:07 Joshua Smith Yeah, it's been good. 33:16 Sean Finnegan Well, that brings this episode to an end. What did you think? Come on over to restitutio.org and find Episode 559 youth ministry matters with Joshua Michael Smith and leave your feedback there. 33:28 Sean Finnegan On last week's episode, someone wrote in saying I am amazed at each person who comes to understand there is one God and he gave his only created by birth son as ransom for us. 33:40 Sean Finnegan Each has a different verse that opens their mind to the truth. Oh God, our father. Open the minds of those hungry for truth, William wrote. Enjoyed listening, was wondering if you could send me to the best teaching on the book of John from a one God perspective. I have a hard time understanding Jesus from heaven verses and teaching on. 34:00 Sean Finnegan Holy Spirit, thanks in advance. 34:03 Sean Finnegan Well, Bill, as it turns out, Dustin Smith has just come out with his book Wisdom Christology in the Gospel of John, which I believe does handle this particular subject in John Chapter 6. 34:16 Sean Finnegan I think it's also pretty easy just to interpret the saying of Christ contextually in that he talks about manna having come from heaven. 34:26 Sean Finnegan And we know, of course, the manna did not fall from the sky. The mana did not exist in a heavenly dimension prior to materializing on Earth or falling to the Earth. That's not how the mana worked at all. It was something that appeared on the ground with the morning do. Why did Jesus say Moses gave you manna from heaven? Well, it's because God was the source. 34:47 Sean Finnegan Of the mana, and of course God is the source of Christ as well, so maybe that will help a little bit to think about it. 34:52 Sean Finnegan Shifting gears for a minute, I did want to mention a number of events coming up to invite you to the first of which is coming up very soon happening in two Sundays from now on August 11th at Guthrie Grove Church of God in Pelzer, SC, I've been invited to speak. 35:13 Sean Finnegan On that Sunday and then to continue speaking Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. So that would be August 12th, 13th and 14th. I think about 7:00 in the evening at the. 35:22 Sean Finnegan Guthrie Grove church. 35:24 Sean Finnegan About my Kingdom journey book. So I'm going to be presenting about the Kingdom of God and if you live in the South Carolina area and would like to come, it would be great to see you there. I'll also bring some books with me to sell and I can sell them a little bit cheaper than you can get them online. And I'd also be happy to sign anybody's book if you want to bring a book. 35:45 Sean Finnegan And really spend some time thinking about the Kingdom of God. This gospel message that Jesus gave the disciples and gave the church to preach and to share with others. So come to that if you're anywhere near the Greenville area of South Carolina Pelzer's not far from there, and it would be great to see you there. Secondly, we. 36:06 Sean Finnegan Are having a weekend event September 13th to the 15th and in a little more than a month from today. 36:14 Sean Finnegan Day and that is called Kingdom Fest and we have this event each year at living Hope and Jerry where we'll coordinates it. He does a great job. We have speakers who are both from the local church but also from other churches such as Victor Gluckin of Living Faith Christian Church and. 36:35 Sean Finnegan Usually also a guest speaker, and I think our guest speaker is yet confirmed, but it is somebody that will bring a lot of energy and excitement. Our theme is radiate. 36:44 Sean Finnegan And if you'd like to come visit, maybe you live outside of New York State and you've been listening to this podcast for a while and something Joshua said in this episode intrigued you or you'd like to meet him, or you'd like to meet me or just spend a weekend. Or you. Maybe you are single and you you're looking to meet somebody. Maybe you have kids and you're looking for a family. 37:05 Sean Finnegan Friendly event. 37:07 Sean Finnegan To really kick off the fall, then Kingdom Fest is the place for you. There's no charge for Kingdom Fest anymore. We got rid of that because it was just keeping people out. But we do have a charge for food plan. If you want to have a food plan which is $60.00 per person for the weekend. It covers the majority of your meals and if you want to know more about Kingdom. 37:28 Sean Finnegan And you're interested in coming. 37:30 Sean Finnegan You can find that information at ldim.org lgim.org this living hope internationalministries.org and it would be great to see you there. Our theme once again is radiate. We're looking at how we can shine our lights in this Dark World and our theme versus Philippians 215 and 16 where it says Shine. 37:51 Sean Finnegan Among them as lights in the world, as you hold fast the word of life. 37:57 Sean Finnegan So if you're interested, come on over to lhim.org. Also, I have a link to the event in the shown us for this episode. Housing accommodations would be on your own, but the food is covered if you pay the $60.00 fee. Or maybe you have a friend you can stay with and you just bring your own food, in which case the whole weekend is totally free. 38:17 Sean Finnegan To you. So if you can make it, it would be great to see you. Good. Great to meet you. If I haven't met you yet and it's a great time of celebration, we rent a big tent and have food outside in one of our parks. 38:29 Sean Finnegan Lots, which maybe doesn't sound too appealing, but it gives it a festive vibe. Last year we had almost 200 people come. 38:38 Sean Finnegan We're trying to beat that this year, so come if you can and it's a very upbeat event, lots of praise music, lots of preaching, not necessarily just teaching, but also preaching and a great kids program. However, if you're more looking for that cerebral connection, then there's also an event in October. 38:59 Sean Finnegan That I'm attending that I would love to invite you to, which is called the Unitarian Christian Alliance Conference. And at this event. 39:09 Sean Finnegan We have much more scholarly sessions, no music and. 39:16 Sean Finnegan It's a great event to hear presentations, theological presentations about biblical Unitarianism. It's a great place to meet others from around the country, and there are also practical workshops. At the same time as the scholarly session. So. 39:33 Sean Finnegan If you're looking to hang out and spend time with fellow biblical Unitarians around that theme, but you're not interested in the scholarly stuff, there's plenty of practical workshops to go to, and this year everything is being held at a venue that provides everything, including food and housing. So if you are interested in the Unitarian Christian. 39:55 Sean Finnegan Alliance conference for 2024. The American one is going to be right outside of Little Rock AR on October 17th to the 20th. 40:06 Sean Finnegan And I think we're going to have a great time. I just submitted my paper yesterday, so I'm hoping to get selected this year to be able to present. But either way, I will be there and I will be having a great time. So I'd love to see you at Guthrie Grove in South Carolina coming up. 40:25 Sean Finnegan In August or at Kingdom Fest on September 13th through the 15th in New York. 40:32 Sean Finnegan Or at Little Rock, AR, October 17th to the 20th. Or I already mentioned this before, but I'm going to be going to Manila and the Philippines in November and also the Hamilton, Cambridge area of New Zealand in November. So hey, I hope to catch you somewhere around this world. 40:52 Sean Finnegan I'm not going everywhere, but I am going to a lot of places about one place a month, give or take, and promoting God's truth and the idea of restorationism and the truths that many of you have come to discover through your own rest. 41:05 Sean Finnegan Search, so I hope to see you at one of these events if you. 41:08 Sean Finnegan Can. 41:09 Sean Finnegan Make it. Well, that's it for this week. Thanks for listening. If you'd like to support us, you can do that at restitutio.org. I'll catch you next week. And remember, the truth has nothing to fear.